Government Shutdown

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Meso
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Re: Government Shutdown

Postby Meso » Mon Apr 11, 2011 12:12 pm

"the Democrats were able to vote and pass healthcare and Wall Street reform against intense opposition"
"against intense opposition"
What person of sound mind would oppose these two issues? Perhaps without this "intense opposition" things of substance would get done.
Seriously, the point of the opposition was little children pouting in the corner.
When a party bands together and blocks the other party just because it is the other party, then its time to dissolve the party system.
Fire the whole lot!!
It will never work though. Too many sheeple voting them back in.

Glauri - AMEN to that. Protect our own borders, mind our own business and get da hell out of the rest of the worlds business and we probably could balance a budget. I'd probably even still have a job if 10% of our population wasn't illegals from the south.

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Re: Government Shutdown

Postby Tarvas » Mon Apr 11, 2011 12:18 pm

Loendar wrote:
Tarvas wrote:Okay, Democrats are right. It is the Republicans fault that a budget was not passed for FY11 in September of 2010. It was the Republicans fault that the Democrats did not even bring the bills to the floor for a vote. It was the Republicans fault that the Democrats were able to vote and pass healthcare and Wall Street reform against intense opposition. I bow before the collective wisdom of the Democratic Party and renounce here and now the entire Republican Party for failing to pass a budget that was never brought to the floor for a vote. Shame on you Republicans for not using your minority of 41 to 59 (Liberman - I) Senators and 179 to 255 Congresssheeples to force a budget through the Congress.

Please forgive me for trying to blame the Democratic Party for failing to pass a budget for political reasons.


If you read anything that was being said you would realize that this isn't a Dem or Repub issue - it is BOTH of them. I'm not saying that the Republicans are at fault for the budget issue, I'm saying that both parties are at fault for their inability to compromise on this and every other issue.

Your continued assertion that the Democrats should have pushed through a budget in 2011 without bi-partisan support and that somehow that would have flown with the Republican party shows a fundamental lack of understanding of the political process.


Then why did the Democrats push through the healthcare reform ( 60–39, 219–212), repeal of DADT (65-31, 250-175), and Wall Street reform (60-39, 237-192 ) without bi-partisan support? My God, even CNN has started questioning why the Democrats did not pass a budget for FY11. The political reality is that the Democrats knew they were going to take a beating in the general elections of 2010 and therefore punted the disaster that is the U.S. Governments budget to the next Congress. Even when they had nothing to fear after the elections were over they still refused to push a budget and instead wasted time on DADT debates. It makes zero sense.

I do not blame the deficit on the Democratic Party alone. The Republicans own a fair share of it just like President Reagan, Bush I, Clinton (left office with a 5+ trillion dollar deficit), Bush II (left office with a 8.6T deficit), and Obama (14T and counting) do.

Meso, I oppose that bill because the Federal Government cannot even balance the budget let alone run a healthcare system for a country of 300 million people. Please name me some federal program that have succeed in the United States History. Healthcare should at best be a state matter as they are more intune with what going on then Congress of people who are too stupid to tie their own shoe laces. By the way, why even pass a bill that even the President of the United States admits is broken?
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Re: Government Shutdown

Postby Loendar » Mon Apr 11, 2011 1:08 pm

Tarvas wrote:Then why did the Democrats push through the healthcare reform ( 60–39, 219–212), repeal of DADT (65-31, 250-175), and Wall Street reform (60-39, 237-192 ) without bi-partisan support? My God, even CNN has started questioning why the Democrats did not pass a budget for FY11. The political reality is that the Democrats knew they were going to take a beating in the general elections of 2010 and therefore punted the disaster that is the U.S. Governments budget to the next Congress. Even when they had nothing to fear after the elections were over they still refused to push a budget and instead wasted time on DADT debates. It makes zero sense.

I do not blame the deficit on the Democratic Party alone. The Republicans own a fair share of it just like President Reagan, Bush I, Clinton (left office with a 5+ trillion dollar deficit), Bush II (left office with a 8.6T deficit), and Obama (14T and counting) do.


The items you cite only illustrate my point. By pushing those items through without bi-partisan support the Republicans are now attempting to dismantle them because they have a majority. Perhaps, just maybe, the Democrats saw the writing on the wall and realized that the only way they could hope to get elected in the future is to NOT ram things through based solely on their own ideals? Maybe they thought something like the budget should have a chance at getting approved by both parties without all the crap that happened with the other items? They didn't push on through at least partially because it was yet another fight they didn't want to have.

As for the Clinton assertion - you should look into that a bit more: http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/d ... deral.html - Bush threw away all the gains that Clinton made.

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Re: Government Shutdown

Postby Tarvas » Tue Apr 12, 2011 3:45 am

We are obviously not going to agree. As far as I am concerned the Congress has a responsibility to at least debate a budget before the fiscal year arrives. No debate was held in 2010 and nobody has come up with a reason why it didn't occur other than the Democrats didn't want to hurt the Republicans feelings again.../throws hands in air.

I know Clinton didn't cause most of the 5.7T debt he left office with. It just the last year I checked. It is easier to do debt by President than by Congress though it should it be done that way. The debt grew under Clinton just over a trillion dollars from 4.6 in 1992 to 5.7 trillion in 2001.
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Re: Government Shutdown

Postby Meso » Tue Apr 12, 2011 3:58 am

"Using data from MRI scans, researchers at the University College London found that self-described liberals have a larger anterior cingulate cortex--a gray matter of the brain associated with understanding complexity. Meanwhile, self-described conservatives are more likely to have a larger amygdala, an almond-shaped area that is associated with fear and anxiety."

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Re: Government Shutdown

Postby Tarvas » Tue Apr 12, 2011 10:55 am

Meso wrote:"Using data from MRI scans, researchers at the University College London found that self-described liberals have a larger anterior cingulate cortex--a gray matter of the brain associated with understanding complexity. Meanwhile, self-described conservatives are more likely to have a larger amygdala, an almond-shaped area that is associated with fear and anxiety."


"Some uncertainties still remain. Researchers said they are unsure whether or not brain structure actually causes a person to lean one way politically or if the opposite is true--the way people think leads to increased brain activity in different regions. They also noted that people often change political views, which fall in more categories that just liberal and conservative."
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Re: Government Shutdown

Postby Goofydoofy » Tue Apr 12, 2011 7:08 pm

Maybe less words and more action would be a better solution.
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